Ramphal offers details on proposals, process
After seeing Tuesday’s presentation, it is clear that Belize’s facilitator, Sir Shridath Ramphal, is nothing if not an optimist. And while no observer has doubted Ramphal’s work ethic, dedication and job performance, a number of observers, including the Leader of the Opposition, have noted that his exuberance can sometimes give the appearance of calculated exaggeration. One area in particular has been the question of the northern section of the Belize-Guatemala frontier. This morning News 5’s Stewart Krohn sat down for a one-on-one with the facilitator in an attempt to find out how it is that what we thought was the border line, is…not exactly.
Sir Shridath Ramphal, Belize’s Facilitator
“We’re not even sure if there is a rectification if you like. What we know is that in a colloquial way, Belizeans have tended to think of the northern most point of the border with Guatemala as Aguas Turbias. In fact, Aguas Turbias was never fixed in the 1859 Treaty. It was fixed many years later as the junction point of the border between Guatemala and Mexico. It happens to be very close to where the northern line, projected from Garbutt’s Falls, touches the Mexican frontier. And so, I think in a colloquial way, it came to be identified with it. What we are saying the proposals is whatever is the situation there, the line is as it was laid down in 1859, it is due north, straight north from Garbutt’s Falls until it reaches the northern most end of the frontier with Guatemala. We have identified that as seventeen degrees, forty-nine minutes.”
Stewart Krohn
“Okay, the question I’m asking though is how did this question come about. If you are say there was colloquial understanding of where the border was, and now we are challenging that colloquial understanding, they had to come from science…
Sir Shridath Ramphal
“Because we’re being more precise, yes.”
Stewart Krohn
“No, but when you say we, what I’m asking is…we know that Paul Peeler came with all his electronic boxes and satellite dishes. Is this is the basis upon which we are saying?”
Sir Shridath Ramphal
“Yes, that is their fixing of the point. The point being the 1859 line due north arrives at that point.”
Stewart Krohn
“Okay, so the Pan American Institute of Geography and History has confirmed that the point, that due north from Garbutt’s Falls arrives at a point which is six hundred and ten feet I am told?”
Sir Shridath Ramphal
“Well yes, we would talk in metres…
Stewart Krohn
“How many meters is it according to your…
Sir Shridath Ramphal
“I thought it was something like under two hundred.”
Stewart Krohn
“Okay, that would work. So in other words, that has been established, it is not, and I presume the P.A.I.G.H. is using the most up to date methods.”
Sir Shridath Ramphal
“Yes, but the P.A.I.G.H. exercise really didn’t go beyond Garbutt’s Falls. In other words, they didn’t carry out a survey to that point.”
Stewart Krohn
“They didn’t carry out a survey, but that used a world class super G.P.S. method to determine what was being…
Sir Shridath Ramphal
“And the OAS subsequent to that carried that projection right up due north…”
Stewart Krohn
“So in other words this theoretical new line, or the…
Sir Shridath Ramphal
“So there is a technical third party process that has established this.”
Stewart Krohn
“So it’s not a conjecture, we know scientifically where due north is, and you are confirming to us that due north of Garbutt’s Falls arrives at a point somewhat a few hundred metres or six hundred and ten feet to the east of where we thought it was?”
Sir Shridath Ramphal
“That’s right.”
For Sonny Ramphal, as well as his counterpart on the Guatemalan side, Paul Reichler, the last two and a half years could not have been easy. We asked Belize’s facilitator to explain how he went about his task.
Sir Shridath Ramphal
“Well it was difficult, but it was not impossible. I never reached the point of despair, I never reach the point of throwing up my hands and saying we can’t go any further. We always knew what the areas of difficulty would be; there were no big surprises. The Guatemalans had I think one area of surprise, because at once they felt there were a lot more Guatemalans on the Belize side of the adjacency line, or what we would say is the border. It turned out, when the OAS mission did its work, this is where it was so good to have OAS mission do that work. They went right through and established that all there was was a hundred and thirty-four people at Santa Rosa. Therefore that reduced the area of controversy immediately. So we weren’t dealing with a vast number of scattered communities, on the Belizean side of the line, but this one. And so we dealt then specifically with, how do we deal with Santa Rosa.”
“In relation to the maritime area, I think that involved the most complex kind of exercise. First of all, it was new, in terms of all the past history. Secondly it involved a third party in terms of Honduras. That turned out to be a good thing for the process because bringing in Honduras meant that you were no longer purely in a bilateral situation and bringing in Honduras greatly enlarged the possibilities of agreement.”
Stewart Krohn
“Let me interrupt, how easy was it to bring the Hondurans into the picture?”
Sir Shridath Ramphal
“It was not very difficult. They saw the advantages to them of being part of this process, and I think those were not just purely self-interested possibilities, but playing an honourable role in making an agreement of this kind possible. So given those two circumstances, they brought tremendous expertise to bear on the delimitation of the maritime areas. Because they have developed a great competence in this area, much larger than the technical competencies in Guatemala and in Belize. So they were a big asset to the process.”
And how did Guatemala’s facilitator, Paul Reichler, manage to deal with the disparity between his client’s unrealistic demands and a practical solution to the claim?
Sir Shridath Ramphal
“Well first of all, Paul Reichler is a very experienced and a very eminent lawyer, well known in Central America, knowing Central America very well. He was the international lawyer who took his country, who took America to the World Court on the mining of the Managua harbour…and won. So he came to the process with a lot of familiarity with the situation. He worked very closely with his constituency in Guatemala, with President Portillo, with Foreign Minister Orellana in particular. And he shared with me a determination that we would find a way, and that was not always easy, there were two professional people with constituencies behind us, but with a determination that we should bring those constituencies along; and eventually we did.”
Ramphal will remain in Belize at least through Independence Day and it is expected that he will return at various times during the seventy-five day period prior to the referendum.
